AILSA CHANG, HOST:
Federal prosecutors in Manhattan have unsealed an indictment against Democratic New York City Mayor Eric Adams today, making him the first sitting New York City mayor to face criminal charges. The indictment alleges that Adams engaged in conspiracy, wire fraud, bribery and soliciting campaign donations from foreign nationals. Adams has so far denied any wrongdoing and says he is staying in his job, despite a growing number of local politicians calling for him to step down. One of those politicians is Democratic New York State Senator, John Liu, who joins us now. Senator Liu, welcome.
JOHN LIU: Thanks for having me.
CHANG: Thanks for being with us. All right, so you have said, quote, "Eric Adams is innocent until proven guilty. He is entitled to his due process." But you've also called for him to resign immediately. Why is that?
LIU: I think very - I feel very strongly that everybody is innocent until proven guilty. That is what the American mainstay has been from the beginning of our country. And Eric Adams is due no less than his due process. But he needs to muster every ounce of his might - in his own words, use every ounce of his own strength and spirit - to fight the charges. And I would expect him to do so. He says he's innocent. I would expect him to fight as hard as he can to maintain his innocence.
But it would be impossible for him or, quite frankly, any human being to fight these kinds of very serious federal charges and, at the same time, run the largest city in the nation. It's just humanly impossible. And that's why I think, for the good of all New Yorkers, that he step aside, focus on his defense and his well-being and let the city move on. He's got a lot of...
CHANG: OK. So it's the good of all New Yorkers...
LIU: Yes.
CHANG: ...And for himself, it sounds like, is your argument. But, you know, we should note - if I may bring this up - that back in 2013, when you were running for mayor, there was a federal investigation into your campaign because of fundraising violations. Two of your associates were convicted. You were not charged, but you had called the U.S. attorney's investigation back then into your campaign a witch hunt. Adams is now saying he has been demonized. That's his word. Does Adams deserve the same benefit of the doubt that you said you deserved back then?
LIU: Well, I...
CHANG: And there are a lot of New Yorkers who want him to stay in the job because...
LIU: Sure.
CHANG: ...They think he does deserve that benefit of the doubt.
LIU: And I'm glad you brought that up. Back in 2013, I specifically said to the U.S. attorney and the FBI, hey, I'm right here. If you want to accuse me of anything, I'm right here. They never accused me of anything. And after I lost the election, I never heard from anybody ever again. Here, on the other hand, we have some serious charges in an indictment - a federal indictment. And this is something that - again, the man is innocent until proven guilty. But he needs to focus on that and let the rest of the city of New York move on.
CHANG: Well, if Adams refuses to resign, as he has so far, Governor Kathy Hochul, who's also a Democrat, could simply remove him herself. Do you think she should?
LIU: That's something that the governor has begun to talk about. She said today that she hasn't had a chance to read the indictment and to consider what the options are and how best to move forward. Again, it's not about what's best for her or for Eric Adams or for any set of individuals. It's what's best for the 8.5 million people of New York City.
CHANG: So if you were governor, you would remove Eric Adams office?
LIU: (Laughter) Well, that's a big, big, hypothetical, Ailsa.
CHANG: (Laughter).
LIU: But if I - I've said what I needed to say, which is that, for the better - for the good of all New Yorkers...
CHANG: All right.
LIU: ...That Eric Adams should focus on what he needs to do for himself.
CHANG: Let me ask you this. There have been so many announcements of high-level resignations, including the police commissioner, the schools' chancellor. If Adams does resign or is removed, how challenging do you think it'll be to rebuild a functioning city government?
LIU: Well, that's the problem here. It all has to be rebuilt, no matter what. It's a question of - how quickly can we move on? And I think we should move on sooner rather than later. If he remains mayor, think about how difficult it would be for him to recruit people for the vacant positions - and they are perhaps...
CHANG: Right.
LIU: ...The most important positions in the city - and also to retain the people who are there already. It is natural for the - for people to start leaving at the end of a term. But we're still 15 months away from the term, and people...
CHANG: And...
LIU: ...Are going...
CHANG: ...We're going to...
LIU: ...To start...
CHANG: ...Have to...
LIU: ...Leaving now.
CHANG: ...Leave it right there. That is Democratic New York State Senator John Liu. Thank you so much.
LIU: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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