A MARTÍNEZ, HOST:
President Biden is in Berlin today to meet with European leaders for the last time while in office.
LEILA FADEL, HOST:
It's a farewell trip of sorts to a region that has been front and center in his presidency since Russia's full-scale invasion of Ukraine. And it comes as the U.S. is poised to elect a new president while the outcome of the war in Ukraine remains uncertain.
MARTÍNEZ: NPR's Berlin correspondent Rob Schmitz joins us now to talk about Biden's trip. So President Biden's going to be joined by leaders from France, Britain and Germany. What's the significance, Rob?
ROB SCHMITZ, BYLINE: Yeah. America's relationship with Europe is stronger than ever, A. And that's largely due to the work that President Biden has done these past four years. After Russia invaded Ukraine in 2022, President Biden was a guiding force in showing support for Ukraine for democracy in Europe, and he reinvigorated a trans-Atlantic spirit that had been left languishing for years before he took office. German Chancellor Olaf Scholz said this and more about Biden's trip earlier this week in an address to the German Parliament.
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OLAF SCHOLZ: (Speaking German).
SCHMITZ: And A, he told Parliament he's grateful for Biden's cooperation over the years, and that Biden quote, "stands for an incredible improvement in that cooperation between Europe and the U.S." And that was a not-so-subtle jab at former President Trump, who was a constant critic of Germany, especially in the EU, as well, over trade and regional security issues.
MARTÍNEZ: So speaking of Trump, he's running for office again. So what do European leaders like Scholz think about the possibility of a second Trump presidency?
SCHMITZ: Yeah. I'd venture to say here that for leaders in this part of Europe, they're very worried about this. In a recent survey by the German think tank Korber Stiftung, 80% of Germans polled say another Trump presidency would damage trans-Atlantic relations. Trump has cast doubts on continued American support for Ukraine. He's even refused to say whether he wants Ukraine to even win against Russia. Should he become president, Europe would be forced to try and fill a gap in U.S. support for Ukraine and simply put, they would not be able to fill that gap. In that scenario, Germany, in particular, would be hard pressed to bolster its own security. It's in the process of trying to modernize its military, and it's doing that very slowly. The last time Trump held office, the former president mused about the U.S. leaving NATO. He ordered the Pentagon to withdraw 12,000 American troops from Germany. Biden later reversed that decision. But should Trump win, German politicians, I think, would be concerned about their country's own security, and they'd likely be forced to pick up the pace on rebuilding the country's military, and that would cost hundreds of billions if not trillions of dollars at a time when Germany's economy is struggling.
MARTÍNEZ: So what would that mean, then, for Germany's role in Europe?
SCHMITZ: Yeah. I mean, most acutely, it would mean that there would be even more pressure for Chancellor Olaf Scholz to leave office. He and his coalition government have historically poor public support at the moment. And with a national election coming next year in Germany, we're looking at a likely change in leadership here in Germany anyway. A Trump presidency could also help further fuel the rising popularity of far-right parties, not only in Germany, but throughout Europe. So it could have broad political implications throughout the continent.
MARTÍNEZ: And one more thing really quick, Rob, have they considered what a Harris presidency might mean? Would it be a continuation of what Biden has done with them?
SCHMITZ: Yeah. They definitely - I think European leaders in this part of Europe definitely see Harris as a definite continuation of Biden's policies, and most importantly, continued support for Ukraine in its defense against Russia.
MARTÍNEZ: All right. That's NPRs Berlin correspondent, Rob Schmitz. Rob, Thanks.
SCHMITZ: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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