LEILA FADEL, HOST:
In an extraordinary security breach, the country's most senior security officials created a group chat on a messaging app to discuss U.S. airstrikes on Yemen.
MICHEL MARTIN, HOST:
Now, two important points about this. First, the group chat was on that commercial messaging app Signal, not a secure U.S. government network. And second, the group included a journalist, Jeffrey Goldberg, editor of The Atlantic magazine, apparently by accident.
FADEL: For more, we're joined by NPR national security correspondent Greg Myre. Hey, Greg.
GREG MYRE, BYLINE: Good morning, Leila.
FADEL: OK, so, I mean, how did this happen?
MYRE: Well, the editor of The Atlantic, Jeffrey Goldberg, said he got a notice on the messaging app Signal on March 11, inviting him to join a group chat regarding the Houthis in Yemen. Now, the invitation came from the national security adviser, Mike Waltz, and included all the top national security officials, including Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth. Now, Goldberg initially thought this was some sort of hoax, someone was trying to entrap him. But over the next few days, the texts increasingly looked to be genuine, with details about U.S. plans to bomb the Houthis in Yemen. Goldberg spoke to All Things Considered yesterday about what then happened on March 15.
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JEFFREY GOLDBERG: I'm sitting in my car, in a parking lot, in a supermarket at 11:44 a.m. Eastern, and I get this war plan from Pete Hegseth.
MYRE: And so two hours later, the U.S. bombing begins in Yemen and Goldberg realizes this is no hoax. These U.S. airstrikes are real, and they're still ongoing. And Hegseth yesterday questioned the credibility of Goldberg, but the National Security Council put out a statement saying the material appeared to be authentic.
FADEL: I mean, it's pretty remarkable. And Democrats have been highly critical of Trump's national security team, saying it lacked experience. Is this an example of that supposed lack of experience?
MYRE: Well, Leila, certainly seems so, and they certainly should have known better. Hegseth often talks about his military experience, as does Waltz. And rest assured, they were never told as soldiers to share military operations in advance on their preferred messaging app and to include emojis, as Waltz apparently did, with a clenched fist, the flag and a fire emoji. And this group also included the nation's top two intelligence officials, CIA Director John Ratcliffe and Director of National Intelligence Tulsi Gabbard. Now, those agencies are absolutely fanatical about secure communications, yet based on Goldberg's account, no senior national security official raised concerns about sharing war plans on Signal.
FADEL: And how do national security officials normally communicate when discussing sensitive military operations?
MYRE: Well, those officials are supposed to use a SCIF, which stands for sensitive compartmented information facility. These secure rooms are built to discuss classified information. You can't take a phone into these rooms. You can't take documents out. And all of these top-ranking national security officials have SCIFs at their offices and at their homes.
FADEL: I mean, makes sense in principle, but how does it work in reality? Senior national security officials are often traveling for work. Their job doesn't end when the weekend comes. Is this practical?
MYRE: Well, it can be very impractical, but that's how it's supposed to be done. These airstrikes against the Houthis in Yemen began on a Saturday afternoon, so officials may not have been near a SCIF. But it doesn't mean they should be discussing the launch of a major U.S. military operation in real time on their phones, on a commercial messaging app.
FADEL: NPR's Greg Myre. Thank you, Greg.
MYRE: Sure thing, Leila. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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